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Crash 'n the Boys: Ice Challenge
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Johnny Undaunted



Joined: 08 Sep 2003
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 15, 2009 9:08 pm    Post subject: Crash 'n the Boys: Ice Challenge Reply with quote

Some hero at Retromags.com have uploaded several back issues of EGM some time ago. Among them was the April 1993 issue, which features a preview of Ice Challenge (the unreleased American version of Ike Ike! Nekketsu Hockey Bu).


Aside from the usual name changes (Nekketsu into Southside, Hanazono into Washington) and a couple of sprite changes, it doesn't seem to had been changed much from the Japanese version compared to Street Challenge.

EDIT: Fixed issue date.


Last edited by Johnny Undaunted on Fri Jan 16, 2009 3:25 am; edited 2 times in total
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Linquesan



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PostPosted: Thu Jan 15, 2009 10:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hey Johnny, I sent you an email a few years ago about Technos. I don't really remember what I asked though. After a rousing session of Super Spike V'Ball the other day, my interest in Technos Japan has been revitalized and I've been scouring the net for any newly uncovered info on the company and their games.

The last I heard about Ice Challenge, there was a prototype 40% finished floating around in some collector's edition. I remember stumbling upon a picture of the box art for the game, and this article indicates the game was "99%" finished, so there must be a fully functional copy, or at least there was at one point. Not that it's a huge deal since it seems to be so similar to the original, but it'd be great to see anyway.

I guess the only interesting question I have would be about the racing game that was purportedly advertised in the Kunio Tachi no Banka manual and when you fight Shinji the first time. Has any info on that surfaced?
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KingMike



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PostPosted: Fri Jan 16, 2009 2:25 am    Post subject: Re: Crash 'n the Boys: Ice Challenge Reply with quote

Johnny Undaunted wrote:
Some hero at Retromags.com have uploaded several back issues of EGM some time ago. Among them was the April 1994 issue,

Thanks for the upload, but I have to kinda nitpick, but I'm pretty sure it wasn't 1994. Perhaps 1993.
I have a few old EGMs around, and in October 1993 (because it was #51) they changed layout and began the "The Good/Bad/Ugly" preview format.
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Johnny Undaunted



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PostPosted: Fri Jan 16, 2009 3:24 am    Post subject: Re: Crash 'n the Boys: Ice Challenge Reply with quote

KingMike wrote:
Johnny Undaunted wrote:
Some hero at Retromags.com have uploaded several back issues of EGM some time ago. Among them was the April 1994 issue,

Thanks for the upload, but I have to kinda nitpick, but I'm pretty sure it wasn't 1994. Perhaps 1993.
I have a few old EGMs around, and in October 1993 (because it was #51) they changed layout and began the "The Good/Bad/Ugly" preview format.


Fixed. It was the April '93 issue, the one with the Bram Stoker's Dracula cover.

Linquesan wrote:
Hey Johnny, I sent you an email a few years ago about Technos. I don't really remember what I asked though. After a rousing session of Super Spike V'Ball the other day, my interest in Technos Japan has been revitalized and I've been scouring the net for any newly uncovered info on the company and their games.

The last I heard about Ice Challenge, there was a prototype 40% finished floating around in some collector's edition. I remember stumbling upon a picture of the box art for the game, and this article indicates the game was "99%" finished, so there must be a fully functional copy, or at least there was at one point. Not that it's a huge deal since it seems to be so similar to the original, but it'd be great to see anyway.


I heard reports that some collector indeed does own a prototype of the game, but nothing definite (probably the same guy who used to work for Tips & Tricks).

Quote:
I guess the only interesting question I have would be about the racing game that was purportedly advertised in the Kunio Tachi no Banka manual and when you fight Shinji the first time. Has any info on that surfaced?


Mad Champ 2088 actually did came out, under the title of Super Mad Champ, but it was published by Tsukuda Original instead of Technos.

The game was actually developed by Almanic, a company formed by ex Technos employees that was around during the early to mid 90's. They were the ones who did Kunio-tachi no Banka as a matter of fact. They also did a bunch of other contractual stuff like the 32X fighting game Cosmic Carnage (Cyber Brawl in Japan), Mazin Saga, and the two Wonder Project J games.

If you're interested to learn about Technos' early days, Yoshihisa Kishimoto actually has his own personal site where he talks about his inspirations for the original Kunio-kun and Double Dragon (did you know the subtitle for Double Dragon 3 comes from the 70's band Rosetta Stone). Believe it or not, he also worked on two early Data East Laserdisc games (Cobra Command and Road Avenger), as well as some Choaniki game for the PS1.
http://wind.ap.teacup.com/kishi/

Also, Mitsuhiro Yoshida (Yoshimitsu) and Hiroyuki Sekimoto (Mokeke) established a doujin group called Miracle Kidz, which has published a few Kunio-kun art books and reference guides, as well as a Dodgeball game for PC (not the same one which came out a while ago for Nintendo DS, which was developed by Arc System Works) titled River City Dodge Ball All-Stars.
http://mkidz.jp/
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Linquesan



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PostPosted: Sat Jan 17, 2009 11:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

How about the Technos Japan composers? I really liked Kazunaka Yamane's soundtracks for the first two Double Dragon games and I believe he did Kunio Tachi no Banka which I really liked. Is it possible to find any info on these guys, like what are they doing now? Or even soundtrack information - I saw that there exists a Super Spike V'Ball arranged soundtrack, assumably in a similar vein as the Double Dragon I and II arranged soundtracks that came out which I thought were great.

It's a good question in general. A lot of composers for NES video games had weird pseudonyms and stuff, but some are enjoying some notoriety like the Konami guy who did Contra and the Final Fantasy composer, among others. Most unfortunately receive no recognition. I'm a huge video game music nerd though, so any info on this guy would be appreciated.

Also, Kazuo Sawa was the other major one. I think he did most of the sports games. His soundtracks were really good for games like the track and field (koushin kyoku?) and River City Ransom.

Those web sites look like a Technos fan's dream come true, but unfortunately I read no Japanese. It is interesting though that back like 10 years ago when I was trying to piece together info on the company from you and what else was available on the net, the actual person responsible for the games are posting about the games now.

Now that I'm thinking and talking Technos now, I remembered the Double Dragon game for Super Nintendo and how it was supposed to be much more than what came out, like with cut scenes and other details. Do those web sites reveal anymore info about that?
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Johnny Undaunted



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PostPosted: Sun Jan 18, 2009 5:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm not certain, but I believe Kazuo Sawa never actually an employee of Technos, but rather worked contractually for them, since he contributed to other companies' games too. He hasn't been credited in any games since the Super Famicom/early PlayStation era though. According to the Japanese Wikipedia article on him, he has been director of meeting and establishment of the Tokai University Jazz Club since 2001. I believe he contributed to one of the Smash Bros. albums.

I can't find anything on Kazunaka Yamane though, other than he also worked on a Famicom strategy game called Takeda Shingen 2 and a mah-jong game for Super Famicom, Super Double Yakuman. Other than that, information on Kazunaka Yamane post-Technos is very scarce.

I've translated Muneki Ebinuma's commentaries on Super Double Dragon and Double Dragon Advance quite a while back. Here's the link for my translations, along with the Japanese originals. Ebinuma actually works mainly as a mo-cap actor for a stuntmen agency. He worked on the Dead or Alive as the motion capture actor for Jann Lee and the Xbox version of Ninja Gaiden.

http://doubledragon.classicgaming.gamespy.com/features/sddtruestory.html
http://doubledragon.classicgaming.gamespy.com/features/ddacommentary.html
http://www.ne.jp/asahi/hzk/kommander/dd4.html
http://www.ne.jp/asahi/hzk/kommander/dda.html

By the way, if you want to play a River City Ransom-esque game for the Super Famicom, I recommend Shonen Ninja Sasuke by Sunsoft. A few ex-Technos staffers actually worked on that game.
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GDRI



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PostPosted: Sun Jan 18, 2009 6:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Johnny Undaunted wrote:
I'm not certain, but I believe Kazuo Sawa never actually an employee of Technos, but rather worked contractually for them, since he contributed to other companies' games too. He hasn't been credited in any games since the Super Famicom/early PlayStation era though. According to the Japanese Wikipedia article on him, he has been director of meeting and establishment of the Tokai University Jazz Club since 2001. I believe he contributed to one of the Smash Bros. albums.


He did the music and sound effects for X-Men: Mutant Wars for the Game Boy Color, which came out in 2000.
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Linquesan



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PostPosted: Sun Jan 18, 2009 8:25 am    Post subject: Re: Crash 'n the Boys: Ice Challenge Reply with quote

Johnny Undaunted wrote:

Mad Champ 2088 actually did came out, under the title of Super Mad Champ, but it was published by Tsukuda Original instead of Technos.

The game was actually developed by Almanic, a company formed by ex Technos employees that was around during the early to mid 90's. They were the ones who did Kunio-tachi no Banka as a matter of fact. They also did a bunch of other contractual stuff like the 32X fighting game Cosmic Carnage (Cyber Brawl in Japan), Mazin Saga, and the two Wonder Project J games.


Haha wow, I just watched a video of Mad Champ 2088 and it is pretty much Kunio Tachi no Banka but just primarily the driving parts. Weird that this was published elsewhere, makes for an interesting piece of trivia. I was expecting a Mario Kart-esque game with Kunio characters.

It also explains no Banka's different feel than other Technos games, at least aesthetically. I personally think it's a really good game and did away with everything that made the previous 'serious' entry in the series, Shodai (?), kind of clumsy and confusing.

Do you know if the Kunio basketball game was ever considered for American release? We know about Ice Challenge and apparently Soccer Challenge was planned, but it seems the basketball game would've been best suited for an American release despite its incredible difficulty. I mean, they are already playing in the United States. I think this one came out in 1993 in Japan though, and future Kunio releases in America were probably out of the question after the apparent failure of Street Challenge and subsequent last-minute cancellation of Ice Challenge.

Also Nekketsu Kakutou Densetsu, the purely fighting one, seemed like it would've been a good choice. I think that one came out before Street Challenge. I mean, I'm just surprised they brought over the wackiest Kunio game with hammer golf and rooftop jumping rather than a game that's a little more advertisable like fighting or soccer or something.

Someone once said that if Ice Challenge came here, it would've been a huge hit. It may not have been a huge hit, but it certainly would've been noticed - probably revered as the best hockey game on the NES, and it would've unquestionably drawn a cult audience similar to the one River City Ransom has. Street Challenge hasn't received cult attention as far as I know.
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Smeg
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 18, 2009 2:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

GDRI wrote:
Johnny Undaunted wrote:
I'm not certain, but I believe Kazuo Sawa never actually an employee of Technos, but rather worked contractually for them, since he contributed to other companies' games too. He hasn't been credited in any games since the Super Famicom/early PlayStation era though. According to the Japanese Wikipedia article on him, he has been director of meeting and establishment of the Tokai University Jazz Club since 2001. I believe he contributed to one of the Smash Bros. albums.


He did the music and sound effects for X-Men: Mutant Wars for the Game Boy Color, which came out in 2000.


Do you have more to go on for that than the listing on MobyGames? I always assumed it was bogus.
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GDRI



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PostPosted: Sun Jan 18, 2009 2:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Smeg wrote:
Do you have more to go on for that than the listing on MobyGames? I always assumed it was bogus.


I don't know why it'd be bogus.

"DSP" (which I think might have been Sawa's company) is credited with the same thing on GBC Blade. Blade and X-Men were both developed by Avit, a company started by former Technos staff.
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Johnny Undaunted



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PostPosted: Sun Jan 18, 2009 3:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
"DSP" (which I think might have been Sawa's company) is credited with the same thing on GBC Blade. Blade and X-Men were both developed by Avit, a company started by former Technos staff.


I forgot completely about Avit/Halcorp (not to be confused with Nintendo's second party HAL Labs, which a lot of fanboys do). It was a company Hiroyuki Sekimoto managed before forming Miracle Kidz. They did a lot of contractual projects, both in Japan and internationally. Blade and Mutant Wars both played like lost Double Dragon sequels to me

Quote:
Someone once said that if Ice Challenge came here, it would've been a huge hit. It may not have been a huge hit, but it certainly would've been noticed - probably revered as the best hockey game on the NES, and it would've unquestionably drawn a cult audience similar to the one River City Ransom has. Street Challenge hasn't received cult attention as far as I know.


It definitely would have been and I don't know why American Technos choose to localize Street Challenge first, considering Ice Challenge was actually an earlier game. Street Challenge is one of the weaker entries in the Kunio series in my opinion and I think its poor reception here prevented Ice Challenge from being released.

Quote:
Do you know if the Kunio basketball game was ever considered for American release? We know about Ice Challenge and apparently Soccer Challenge was planned, but it seems the basketball game would've been best suited for an American release despite its incredible difficulty. I mean, they are already playing in the United States. I think this one came out in 1993 in Japan though, and future Kunio releases in America were probably out of the question after the apparent failure of Street Challenge and subsequent last-minute cancellation of Ice Challenge.


Doubt it, considering Street Basket came out late during the Famicom's life. I do know there were plans to publish a "Diamond Challenge" in the US, which would've probably been a localization of Nekketsu Baseball
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Smeg
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 18, 2009 6:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

GDRI wrote:
Smeg wrote:
Do you have more to go on for that than the listing on MobyGames? I always assumed it was bogus.


I don't know why it'd be bogus.

"DSP" (which I think might have been Sawa's company) is credited with the same thing on GBC Blade. Blade and X-Men were both developed by Avit, a company started by former Technos staff.


MobyGames is notorious for inaccurate, uncited listings. That Sawa should suddenly re-emerge after more than half a decade of inactivity, and with such a shitty showing no less, seems suspect to me.
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Johnny Undaunted



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PostPosted: Mon Jan 19, 2009 5:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

To be fair, Technos wasn't exactly a big league game developer to begin with. After Kunio and Double Dragon, they more or less became a one-product house, releasing nothing but Kunio games and the occasional Double Dragon sequel. They only began to branch out when the Kunio series was no longer profitable in Japan, but they never scored a big hit after that, not that they didn't try (see the overhyped, but now forgotten Gowcaizer).
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GDRI



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PostPosted: Mon Jan 19, 2009 10:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Johnny Undaunted wrote:
I forgot completely about Avit/Halcorp (not to be confused with Nintendo's second party HAL Labs, which a lot of fanboys do).


Actually, there is a connection. HAL Corporation was headed by Mikio Ikeda (executive producer on NES Rollerball and FC Egger Land, producer on FC Uchuu Keibitai SDF and NES New Ghostbusters II).

In addition to dabbling in games, they had put out hardware like this, this, this, this, this, and this. They also had software like Hyper HAL-CATCH and Mobile Editor. They also distributed this Popeye screensaver.

Smeg wrote:
MobyGames is notorious for inaccurate, uncited listings. That Sawa should suddenly re-emerge after more than half a decade of inactivity, and with such a shitty showing no less, seems suspect to me.


Not quite that long. He did AC The Game Paradise!: Master of Shooting! (1995) and AC Tetris Plus (1996).

Japanese Wikipedia says he started a game music company around 1993. Probably DSP.
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mrdomino



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PostPosted: Wed Jan 21, 2009 5:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

GDRI wrote:
Smeg wrote:
Do you have more to go on for that than the listing on MobyGames? I always assumed it was bogus.


I don't know why it'd be bogus.

"DSP" (which I think might have been Sawa's company) is credited with the same thing on GBC Blade. Blade and X-Men were both developed by Avit, a company started by former Technos staff.


oh that's who Avit are? I wondered about that a while back when I picked up "V-Ball: Beach Volley Heroes", the extremely obscure 1998 PAL-only PS1 entry in the V-ball series published by Funsoft. it has an American Technos logo on the cover and on the back of the box it says "Developed by AVIT Inc", but the music is credited in the manual to "Thomas Egeskov Pedersen/Maniacs of Noise". i always thought that maybe american technos left the game unfinished and musicless when they went out of business, and funsoft just picked up the rights and got some german dutch dude to add music in, but i dunno how right i am on that one.


Last edited by mrdomino on Wed Jan 21, 2009 7:01 pm; edited 1 time in total
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GDRI



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PostPosted: Wed Jan 21, 2009 6:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mrdomino wrote:
oh that's who Avit are? I wondered about that a while back when I picked up "V-Ball: Beach Volley Heroes", the extremely obscure 1998 PAL-only PS1 entry in the V-ball series published by Funsoft. it has an American Technos logo on the cover and on the back of the box it says "Developed by AVIT Inc", but the music is credited in the manual to "Thomas Egeskov Pedersen/Maniacs of Noise". i always thought that maybe american technos left the game unfinished and musicless when they went out of business, and funsoft just picked up the rights and got some german dude to add music in, but i dunno how right i am on that one.


Sounds like it to me. Never even heard of the game.
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Johnny Undaunted



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PostPosted: Wed Jan 21, 2009 11:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mrdomino wrote:


oh that's who Avit are? I wondered about that a while back when I picked up "V-Ball: Beach Volley Heroes", the extremely obscure 1998 PAL-only PS1 entry in the V-ball series published by Funsoft. it has an American Technos logo on the cover and on the back of the box it says "Developed by AVIT Inc", but the music is credited in the manual to "Thomas Egeskov Pedersen/Maniacs of Noise". i always thought that maybe american technos left the game unfinished and musicless when they went out of business, and funsoft just picked up the rights and got some german dutch dude to add music in, but i dunno how right i am on that one.


I believe Beach Volley Heroes did came out in Japan, but under a different title. I can't remember what the Japanese version was called, but I believe it was one of those bargain priced PS games
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mrdomino



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PostPosted: Thu Jan 22, 2009 12:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

well i wasnt aware of any japanese release myself, and i havent found one yet, although my research mostly consisted of typing "volley" into gamefaqs and googling everything that came up for screenshots.

but i did also come across a game from 1999 called 超戦闘球技ヴァンボーグ "Super Combat Ball Game VANBORG" or however you want to translate that, which is supposedly developed by Avit according to SIT Developer Table and looks like some kind of fantasy/sci-fi/knockers variation on volleyball judging from the one screenshot i could find here and the boxart here. so its quite possible that beach volley heroes was used as the basis for that game, at least.
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KlarthAilerion
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 28, 2009 4:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

cover art.
catalog number: SLES-00846

Could the aforementioned Japanese budget title possibly be The Beach Volley in the Simple 1500 Series (Vol. 72) released by D3 in Japan in 2001? I don't know if an image of either game has been ripped, so this is just speculation based on speculation here.

I would be interested to see where the sputtering end to the corpse of Technos occurred, though.
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Johnny Undaunted



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PostPosted: Sat Jan 31, 2009 7:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

KlarthAilerion wrote:
cover art.
catalog number: SLES-00846

Could the aforementioned Japanese budget title possibly be The Beach Volley in the Simple 1500 Series (Vol. 72) released by D3 in Japan in 2001? I don't know if an image of either game has been ripped, so this is just speculation based on speculation here.

I would be interested to see where the sputtering end to the corpse of Technos occurred, though.


I see screenshots of The Beach Volley and I don't think its the same game. I know a guy mentioned the title of the game to me, but I lost his e-mail.

Interesting thing I've learned today. The cover artist for the Japanese Game Boy version of Double Dragon (see here) and the Japanese flyer for Double Dragon 3 (see here) is a Ms. Kazumi Kakizaki (かきざき 和美). You can see her signature in both illustrations behind the Technos logo in both art. She probably did the Double Dragon II cover art as well, judging by the similar style.


She did quite a few fantasy-themed manga involving half-naked warrior women during the early 90's, as well as manga adaptations of X-Files and Waterworld. She seems to be pretty obscure though, considering she doesn't even have an article in the Japanese Wikipedia.

I did find a waybacked version of her homepage though
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