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Exerion II
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Skrybe
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Joined: 28 Aug 2003
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 07, 2009 5:03 pm    Post subject: Exerion II Reply with quote

Another new release over at NintendoAGE. They're calling it Exerion 2, since I think that's what the cart says, but the game itself is the original Exerion with updated graphics and music.
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LocalH



Joined: 15 May 2004
Posts: 160

PostPosted: Mon Jun 08, 2009 9:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yet more hacked ROMs... *sigh*
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PACHUKA



Joined: 28 Feb 2004
Posts: 105

PostPosted: Tue Jun 09, 2009 3:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

yeah h =\

I have one with the removed watermark @ cult. However, I didn't remove the 2009 part
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Jurai



Joined: 07 Jun 2006
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 11, 2009 7:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

PACHUKA wrote:
yeah h =\

I have one with the removed watermark @ cult. However, I didn't remove the 2009 part


Yet more hacked ROMs... *sigh*
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ArnoldRimmer83
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 11, 2009 7:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This proto is interesting. Nice try by Jaleco to disguise the game's age with the spiffy new title screen, complete with a new song. The updated graphics do look nice in some spots.

This is pretty similar to what they did with the US version of City Connection. That game added some cut scenes between levels, and a whole new title screen featuring a new protagonist. (Some blond James Dean guy, replacing the winking girl in the Famicom game.) I was kind of hoping this Exerion update would also have some cut scene graphics added, but no dice. I looked at the rom in a tile editor.
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Skrybe
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 12, 2009 11:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ArnoldRimmer83 wrote:
This is pretty similar to what they did with the US version of City Connection.

Yeah, I was really impressed when I realized how much new material was added to City Connection.
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Evan



Joined: 17 Mar 2004
Posts: 948

PostPosted: Sat Jun 13, 2009 5:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I really question the point of removing their watermark hacks. You are still left with a hack regardless. As long as the game is playable and not interupted by them, who cares?
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BMF54123
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 13, 2009 8:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm just waiting for the day the watermarking triggers a game's hidden copy protection routines, a la Konami (severely ramped-up difficulty and the like). Razz
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PACHUKA



Joined: 28 Feb 2004
Posts: 105

PostPosted: Sat Jun 13, 2009 10:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Evan wrote:
I really question the point of removing their watermark hacks. You are still left with a hack regardless. As long as the game is playable and not interupted by them, who cares?


Basically it's saying "fuck you" to the people who corrupted it to begin with. It's called mockery.
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LocalH



Joined: 15 May 2004
Posts: 160

PostPosted: Sat Jun 13, 2009 1:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Now let me make sure I understand these situations right.

Am I right when I say that the modifications are a condition of dumping? Or is it all NA doing this? I know Frank et al have gotten numerous dumps out of Jason without having to hack them, but I don't know about NA.

I thought this practice died down when crack intros became unwanted, apparently not... As long as the unmodified original data is still backed up with Wilson, I'm cool with it...maybe "we" (meaning the scene since I'm broke) could throw a few more bucks towards Jason to get the unmolested dumps?
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Evan



Joined: 17 Mar 2004
Posts: 948

PostPosted: Sat Jun 13, 2009 3:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

LocalH wrote:
Now let me make sure I understand these situations right.

Am I right when I say that the modifications are a condition of dumping? Or is it all NA doing this? I know Frank et al have gotten numerous dumps out of Jason without having to hack them, but I don't know about NA.

I thought this practice died down when crack intros became unwanted, apparently not... As long as the unmodified original data is still backed up with Wilson, I'm cool with it...maybe "we" (meaning the scene since I'm broke) could throw a few more bucks towards Jason to get the unmolested dumps?


Yeah, the watermarks are essentially a condition by DreamTR for dumping these games. Between the choice of released and watermarked or kept unavailable to the public, I choose the sooner.

edit: blah I screwed up


Last edited by Evan on Sat Jun 13, 2009 10:17 pm; edited 1 time in total
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ProgrammingAce



Joined: 26 May 2006
Posts: 580

PostPosted: Sat Jun 13, 2009 4:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I look at the water marking and the proto modification as a way to double dip. First you get paid a couple hundred bucks and release a modified version of the cart.. Later you can still go back and sell the prototype cart as "the original, unmodified version of the game".

All for a total price of well more then you could have sold the game on ebay. Doing the math, there seems to be a much higher profit margin for buying a proto for a few hundred and selling a hundred copies to the community. Expect a lot more people to start doing it once they crunch the numbers of $60 x 100.

I really think that the whole "donate to release" thing is going to die out pretty quick. There's no way such a small community can keep donating thousands of dollars to a few select people
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MrMark0673



Joined: 19 Feb 2009
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 13, 2009 6:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ProgrammingAce wrote:

All for a total price of well more then you could have sold the game on ebay. Doing the math, there seems to be a much higher profit margin for buying a proto for a few hundred and selling a hundred copies to the community. Expect a lot more people to start doing it once they crunch the numbers of $60 x 100.


Having just released a game myself, you do understand that $60 x $100 doesn't factor in ANY overhead costs, right? Assuming the prototype, cart shells, PCBs, EProms, UV eraser, labels, manuals, boxes/tins, solder, desoldering station, paypal fees, shipping costs, shipping supplies, and your TIME, are all free, then yes, $60 x $100 sounds great!

We just received 3 more unreleased NES games last night that we'll be releasing the same way as this last one, along with the other 2 unreleased games that I have already had lined up. People were complaining in '03 that Arcadia VI would never get released, and now that I own it, it actually will. That being said, it will be released on my terms, repro'd and sold, then the ROM will be made available to the public.

Hoppin' Mad was unfinished and barely playable until I had Zzap! finish the game. The original game is backed up on my comp and the original proto will NEVER be sold by me, so double dipping is not an issue.

I love proto collecting and releasing, you're fucked no matter how you go about releasing games these days.
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drx



Joined: 15 Apr 2006
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 13, 2009 7:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

MrMark0673 wrote:
I love proto collecting and releasing, you're fucked no matter how you go about releasing games these days.


Hey mommy, can I be a martyr too when I grow up?

I have released more than three protos and nobody has egged my house yet. Beginners luck I guess.

So... we've got charging the big bucks (which I don't condemn, why take less if someone is willing to be taken for a ride) for hacked protos; then more hacked protos because apparently we need several different versions of the same ROM around, none really genuine; then some holy offense taken at the fact that someone might dare to have a different opinion than those in position of randomly attributed power (the I'm more right than you because I am the one doing the releasing not you argument. If I had never released anything $1500 says I'd be replied with "so what, it's not like you ever funded anything with YOUR money?" which I saw at the other places).

Oh and yeah, the name calling. Will calling someone a hoarder just to poison the well never get old? (Speaking of which, why is the OmoChaoAbuser or whatever he's calling himself everywhere not getting blocked for trolling?)

But yeah, most people don't know the difference. Or don't care about getting screwed. Donators or nondonators. So if almost noone cares and the screwing is small, almost unnoticable, that makes it right, right? Right?

I guess I could go on, but I've fanned the flames enough.
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ProgrammingAce



Joined: 26 May 2006
Posts: 580

PostPosted: Sat Jun 13, 2009 7:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

MrMark0673 wrote:

Having just released a game myself, you do understand that $60 x $100 doesn't factor in ANY overhead costs, right? Assuming the prototype, cart shells, PCBs, EProms, UV eraser, labels, manuals, boxes/tins, solder, desoldering station, paypal fees, shipping costs, shipping supplies, and your TIME, are all free, then yes, $60 x $100 sounds great!


I don't fault you for doing it, it's just business. Considering how quickly you sold out, there's obviously a huge demand for the product. I'd bet if you had charged an extra $10, you still would have sold out.

And I know exactly what it costs to make repro NES carts. I know exactly what the tins cost you because i sourced them out myself last week. I know exactly what the manuals cost, i have a pretty good idea what the donner carts cost, and so on, and so on...

I'm pretty sure there's a healthy profit to be made.

As it stands now, anyone can go out and spend a few hundred on a prototype from DreamTR (or any other seller), make up some repro carts for a few grand, and sell them for a healthy profit. After seeing how well it works, i fully expect a lot more people to start doing it.

Most people never plan on selling the prototypes they've bought, why not take this opportunity to make some cash off of them?

The thing i begin to wonder about though, how many people bought hoppin' mad because they thought it was a fun game or because they really wanted to play it? How many people bought it because they think the limited quantity is going to make the price go up and they can resell later for a profit?

As more and more people start to sell repros of prototypes, the overall collectibility is going to go down. Would you still be able to sell hoppin' mad at $60 when you have 25-30 other prototype games to compete against?

Would you have as many people who are speculating on the future market price?
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Smeg
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 13, 2009 7:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

drx wrote:
no one cares and the screwing is small, almost unnoticable


I have this problem a lot Sad
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MrMark0673



Joined: 19 Feb 2009
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 13, 2009 9:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ProgrammingAce wrote:
MrMark0673 wrote:

Having just released a game myself, you do understand that $60 x $100 doesn't factor in ANY overhead costs, right? Assuming the prototype, cart shells, PCBs, EProms, UV eraser, labels, manuals, boxes/tins, solder, desoldering station, paypal fees, shipping costs, shipping supplies, and your TIME, are all free, then yes, $60 x $100 sounds great!


I don't fault you for doing it, it's just business. Considering how quickly you sold out, there's obviously a huge demand for the product. I'd bet if you had charged an extra $10, you still would have sold out.

And I know exactly what it costs to make repro NES carts. I know exactly what the tins cost you because i sourced them out myself last week. I know exactly what the manuals cost, i have a pretty good idea what the donner carts cost, and so on, and so on...

I'm pretty sure there's a healthy profit to be made.

As it stands now, anyone can go out and spend a few hundred on a prototype from DreamTR (or any other seller), make up some repro carts for a few grand, and sell them for a healthy profit. After seeing how well it works, i fully expect a lot more people to start doing it.

Most people never plan on selling the prototypes they've bought, why not take this opportunity to make some cash off of them?

The thing i begin to wonder about though, how many people bought hoppin' mad because they thought it was a fun game or because they really wanted to play it? How many people bought it because they think the limited quantity is going to make the price go up and they can resell later for a profit?

As more and more people start to sell repros of prototypes, the overall collectibility is going to go down. Would you still be able to sell hoppin' mad at $60 when you have 25-30 other prototype games to compete against?

Would you have as many people who are speculating on the future market price?


You have no idea how much manuals cost me, I went through a friend. And since when is Dream selling protos for a few hundred? He wants nearly $1,000 just for exclusive rights to a dump, he wants $7,000 to BUY War on Wheels.

Also, if you think I am ever going to have to worry about competing against 25-30 protos released in the same way I'm releasing mine, keep fucking dreaming dude. There aren't enough people with the protos and the time and skills to reproduce games the way that we are.

I just find it funny that a bunch of people bitch when protos get released this way. Sounds like some people are jealous that NA is actually getting these things out there.

Anyway, like I said we have 5 more games (at the very least) to release in this manner, I'll make sure to let you guys know where you can buy them Smile
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drx



Joined: 15 Apr 2006
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 13, 2009 10:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Smeg wrote:
drx wrote:
no one cares and the screwing is small, almost unnoticable


I have this problem a lot Sad


Yeah same here...

Quote:
Sounds like some people are jealous that NA is actually getting these things out there.


Yeah because they are the ones putting NINTENDOAGE on title screens of protos. You know, credit whoring, putting a name just like that on something (where often copyright appears, talk about cheeky) that a team of people spent a year or two of their lives to work on and investors their money to invest in it and the possibly only copy in existence in 50 years is going to be ROM with NINTENDOAGE in the most visible part of the game.

No wonder Jason gave you the 7k quote.
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MrMark0673



Joined: 19 Feb 2009
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 13, 2009 10:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My release not only doesn't have NA on it, but I also kept every single one of the programmer's name in the ROM just so they could get credit for all of their hard work that went totally unnoticed for 20 years. I also attempted to contact all 3 members of the design team, two did not return phone calls/emails and one is dead.

When was the last time you released an UNRELEASED NES game? NA brought you guys Happy Camper, Mike Tyson's Intergalactic Power Punch, Exerion II, Uforce Powergames (although Skrybe released his as well for free, which was really cool of him), and Hoppin' Mad THIS YEAR. You guys don't lose shit, you just don't get the giant edicks for releasing games you were all hoping for.

Anyway, I couldn't care less if you agree with what we're doing, we're still going to get these games released to people who will appreciate them (and people who won't).
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adaml
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 13, 2009 10:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

MrMark0673 wrote:
My release not only doesn't have NA on it, but I also kept every single one of the programmer's name in the ROM just so they could get credit for all of their hard work that went totally unnoticed for 20 years. I also attempted to contact all 3 members of the design team, two did not return phone calls/emails and one is dead.

When was the last time you released an UNRELEASED NES game? NA brought you guys Happy Camper, Mike Tyson's Intergalactic Power Punch, Exerion II, Uforce Powergames (although Skrybe released his as well for free, which was really cool of him), and Hoppin' Mad THIS YEAR. You guys don't lose shit, you just don't get the giant edicks for releasing games you were all hoping for.

Anyway, I couldn't care less if you agree with what we're doing, we're still going to get these games released to people who will appreciate them (and people who won't).


Edicks? Not to sound like a dick, but not everyone is in it for accolades and edicks. If that is your pleasure, who am I to fault ya? I'm fairly certain that every single proto that this site released went out for free without any screen hacking, that I'm aware of. I appreciate being able to play these new games and really do not give a shit if a title screen is hacked, but it's probably not a good idea to go on the offensive against an entire site like Lost Levels (which it seems like you are implying with "you guys", though you could just be referring to the few people objecting to the hacking...if I am wrong, let me know) just because a few people voice their displeasure at hacked title screens in your proto releases.

Which one of the programmers died anyway?
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